First Run [OOC]

Image
In the harsh reality of the 2070s where profit is the most important mistress, the bigger the metroplex, the deeper the shadows. In the cracks between the giant corporate structures, criminals of all shades find their homes. When the megacorps want a job done but don’t want to dirty their hands, they turn to the only people who can pull it off: shadowrunners, deniable assets.

Moderator: PMiller

First Run [OOC]

Postby PMiller » Wed May 11, 2016 12:13 am

Here is a thread for discussions OOC so you can do them separate from the IC thread.

Link to Old OOC Thread

Link to Supernova IC Thread

Link to Dice Rolling Thread
:smt024
Playing & DMing: Anytime, anywhere.
DM Workshop Notes
User avatar
PMiller
Gaming Commander
Gaming Commander
 
Posts: 12313
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:33 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby PMiller » Wed May 11, 2016 12:21 am

Herzog and pvgerwe can discuss characters in this thread.
:smt024
Playing & DMing: Anytime, anywhere.
DM Workshop Notes
User avatar
PMiller
Gaming Commander
Gaming Commander
 
Posts: 12313
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:33 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Herzog » Wed May 11, 2016 3:03 am

Checking in. Hiya all.

Looking to roll with a mage. Going to retread a elf mage with multiple personality disorder that was used in two previous failed shadow run games. Just need to figure out the window conversion....
GMing
The Black Company and Fallout
User avatar
Herzog
Legend
Legend
 
Posts: 3140
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:26 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Hat » Wed May 11, 2016 8:59 am

Hey Herzog,

As you're taking combat mage, I'm thinking Face, though magic based. I'm toying with the idea of him constantly changing his appearance using Mask, so that his "signature" appearance is that he never looks the same twice. I'm thinking photographic memory, linguist (depending on what it does here), first impression and probably erased, though haven't decided on which level. 2 or 3 foci to sustain multiple physical mask spells and some sort of item - glasses, jewelry, something as a key beyond being able to substantiate who it is.

Thoughts? Btw, Paro: feasible or too impractical in terms of the shifting appearance?

Herzog: Where's your mage from? Happy to build a back story or at least some connections.

With a sweep of his...

Hat
Hat
Villager
Villager
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 8:32 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Herzog » Wed May 11, 2016 9:47 am

The character was originally from mininapolis/st paul, mn. over the course of the two failed games, she ended up in Seattle for its better shadow running pastures. I am open to change and tweaking to make it work with this new game.

The character had a talislegger contact, so perhaps that is one of many possibly links

She also had the multiple personality disorder negative qualityas her most outstanding trait of the character. What this means is each personality does not have complete access to the characters skill set. I went with two personalities, one more nurturing and caring. The other more brash and violent. Healing , social vs combat. It also makes the character a bit nuts as she has monologes out loud and in her head among the two personalities. She also had the Dark Goddess mentor spirit that went with the MPD quality and the dual nature. Dark goddess boost heal and combat spells in SR4.

She had two foci, a black choker and a silver bracelets. One was a sustaining foci, the other a power foci I think.

Spells that I recall were invisibility, levitate, a suite of combat spells, heal, and some detection spells among other things. Also some skill in summoning.

Here is the old SR4 sheet: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1T0w ... U_1k4/edit

Of course, no idea yet on how much of this will translate the to The Window.
GMing
The Black Company and Fallout
User avatar
Herzog
Legend
Legend
 
Posts: 3140
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:26 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Delia2531 » Wed May 11, 2016 10:02 am

Hi folks; just checking in!
Still getting used to the site; please bear with. :)
User avatar
Delia2531
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:00 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Hat » Wed May 11, 2016 3:36 pm

Herzog,

Depending on what you feel are comparable skill levels, you may find yourself short of points. Active skills, knowledge skills, languages and contacts are all bought out of the same pool of XP at the same point costs. The benefits of cyber and bioware at least at character creation is significantly diminished. For example, to move the Strength stat from d20 to d12 takes 3 XP. You spend 1 XP/bioware muscle augmentation level and effectively transfer those XP into the stat pool as the stat pool is 44 points. D12 seems to be considered "average" ability, so on the one hand needing muscle aug 3 to go from poor to average strength seems out of whack. If on the other hand you focus on getting the Shadowrun flavor right rather than trying to get exact mechanical equivalents, it's fine. The Window uses a completely different task resolution mechanic so the success curves are different and trying to map bonuses from one system to the other challenging at best. As Paro has it set up, the system is internally consistent and balanced while importing the SR universe.

I haven't played the system at all, but that's my take on things perusing the mechanics. Delia or one of the other players can likely speak more clearly to how well it captures the feel of the game.

With a sweep of his...

Hat
Hat
Villager
Villager
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 8:32 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Herzog » Wed May 11, 2016 4:11 pm

It's more of taking a look at my last character sheet and figuring out what makes sense to transfer to the window character. Not an unfamiliarity with the system and how it works. I've got experience in that and converting D20 characters over. Just not with Shadowrun.

The beauty of the Window is the flexibility. It boils everything down, and doesn't restrict a character to a single class so much. At least when compared to a D20 system.

ANyway, I am working on a rough draft on the conversion. Will post it up later tonight for review.
GMing
The Black Company and Fallout
User avatar
Herzog
Legend
Legend
 
Posts: 3140
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:26 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Herzog » Wed May 11, 2016 6:01 pm

OK, so I have numerous questions and such that I need clarification on:

------------------
Assensing, Astral Project, Astral Perception, Astral Combat, and Astral Tracking.
From reading the document, i want to make sure I understand how these work in the conversion:

Assensing is a Skill. Having it allows a character to astral perception, Astral Project (if having the magician quality), and Astral Tracking.
Astral Combat is a separate skill.

Is my understanding correct?
-----------------
Magic Trait: In this conversion, does the magic trait link or cap anything? Is it used for anything besides Drain? Guide doesn't specify.
----------------
How should Mentor Spirits be handled? It is a quality (d20 rung as it's 5bp cost in SR4) that provides a numeric bonus to certain spell types, skills, etc while also having a disadvantage. What should those bonus's translate to?
Here is the one I had on the old SR4 Sheet:
Mentor Spirit: Dark Goddess, pg 181 Street Magic
Advantages: +2 dice for Combat and Health spells.
Disadvantages: Ruled by extremes of both creation and destruction, followers of the Dark Goddess often relish in confrontation. They must make a Willpower + Charisma(3) Test to avoid escalating a conflict, no matter how small, into a major clash, whether physical, mental, or social.

------------------------
Focused Concentration:
Defined as +1 to dice pool per rank for all Drain checks. How should this translate? It is 10BP in SR4 per rank...Should each rank be a rung on the competency ladder? And how would the modifier work...would it be a straight -1 on drain checks?
--------------------------
Sensitive System is 15BP in SR4...what rung is that for the window? D12 or d10? pg 83 of core book
---------------------------
Multiple Personality Disorder is 20BP in SR4....what run is that for the window? D10 or higher? pg 164 of Augmentation book.
------------------------
Summoning and Watcher Spirits. According the SR4 core, any one with summoning skill can summon a watcher spirit. Is this something that would still need to be purchased as a super power, or is it a freebie like Astral Combat/Perception/Tracking?
-----------------------
Does Hat and myself get any bonus xp to spend after character generation as we are coming into an established game? To bring our characters up to par with the existing?


ANd here is what i have so far....very much a work in progress. Answers/Clarifications above will certainly changes things. I am thinking of dropping a few spells too. Got to have enough SP for money...It also looks like Sybil won't be as experienced of a runner as her last SR4 sheet. Which is fine. Nothing is set in stone. I am not sure I am happy with skill selection at this point either.

Sybil | Show
Sybil

Purchase Trained skill initially at d30 = 1 point
Improve from d30 to d20 = 2 points (also for initial training in Untrained Skills)
Improve from d20 to d12 = 3 points
Improve from d12 to d10 = 4 points
Improve from d10 to d8 = 5 points
Improve from d8 to d6 = 6 points
Improve from d6 to d4 = 7 points

44xp for traits
Strength 1d30 -> d20 (2xp)
Agility 1d30 -> d12 (5xp)
Health 1d30 -> d12 (5xp)
perception 1d30 -> d10 (9xp)
Wisdom 1d30 -> d8 (14xp)
Luck 1d30 -> d20 (2xp)

?Magicians Magic d12 -> d10 (4xp)
Essence: d4

3 left over

Skills:

80 xp to spend:

12 initial skills: (34 so far)
1. *Sorcery d20 -> d8 (12xp)
2. Counterspelling d20 -> d12 (3xp)
3. Assensing d20
4. Astral Combat d20
5. Conjuring d20
6. Stealth d20 -> d10 (7xp)
7. ?Arcana d20
8. Athletics d20 -> d12 (3xp)
9. Firearms d20 -> d12 (3xp)
10. ?Melee Weapons D20
11. ?First Aid D20 -> d12 (3xp)
12. ?Know: Magic Lore d20 -> d12 (3xp)

Free skills from Wisdom – 3 total, also 14 free xp from Wisdom buy
13. Language: Sperethial d20 -> d10 (7xp of free)
14. Know: Magic Theory d20 -> d10 (7xp of free)
15. Know: Criminal Organizations d20

Purchased: (12 +??)
Magician d12! (6xp)
Lowlight (req Elf) (3xp)
Quality: Focused Concentration (10 in SR4)??
Quality: Mentor Spirit (5 in SR4) ?? d20 (3xp)
Quality: Multiple Personality Disorder (-20 in SR4)??
Quality: Sensitive System (-15 in SR4)??

Spells: (30xp so far)
Combat
*Manabolt d20(3xp) (going to spend more points)
Flamethrower d20 (3xp)
Detection
Detect Enemies d20 (3xp)
Detect Magic d20 (3xp)
Health
Heal d20 (3xp)
?Increase Reflexes d20 (3xp)
?Detox d20 (3xp)
Illusion
*Invisibility d20 (3xp) (going to spend more points)
Manipulation
?Armor d20 (3xp)
Levitate d20 (3xp)

76 so far total, plus ?? from negative qualities.
GMing
The Black Company and Fallout
User avatar
Herzog
Legend
Legend
 
Posts: 3140
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:26 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Hat » Wed May 11, 2016 7:08 pm

My understanding is that for negative qualities it works as follows: 5BP (-d20) [-3XP], 10BP (-d12) [-6XP], 15BP (-d10) [-10 XP], 20BP (-d8) [-15XP]

For the magical skills, I have the same understanding, right or wrong. As a side note, Counterspelling seems to be a part of the Sorcery skill as it's not listed as a separate skill in the skill list which gives you a few XP back.

Magical trait - Not sure what buying up the trait does. So if I advance d12 to d10 for Magician, what impact does that have? There are additional abilities opened up when one initiates, not sure how that translates here either. I was leaning towards Hermetic tradition with the combat mage, but may go shamanic for the face. Probably not, but still considering

For traits and bio/cyberware, there's a lot of stuff that I'm not sure how it translates. I'm considering getting a Trama Dampner, but not sure what it does here.

As for characters, I considered trying to import a previous character or NPC I was fond of from old campaigns, but they don't fit the power level.

With Sybil it looks like she's well suited for spell casting, being stealthy and has the fundamentals on a lot of different skills.

What kind of personality would both of Sybil's personalities get along with? Just thinking if we've known each other for a while, that's a reality we've already negotiated.

With a sweep of his...

Hat
Hat
Villager
Villager
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 8:32 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Delia2531 » Thu May 12, 2016 12:36 am

I had similar sorts of challenges during citation when I tried to 1:1 map Franz across from Sr4.

When I built him; actually the first time he was an androgynous female (playing on the Terry Pratchettjoke about all dwarves looking alike) I had in mind a P-Jumper from the U.S. Military (like in Blackhawks Down) the guys who drop in to combat to patch up and pick up the wounded in hot environments when a traditional cas-evac is not possible; sort of like a high-level DocWagon contract but just one man who comes along with the team to deal with things on the ground and available to Shadowrunners and the like. Plus those skills of being able to move in most environments. I termed him an extraction expert, rather than an insertion expert. Insertion is sneaking about Splinter Cell-esque; Franz is loud (chainsaw, explosives etc) and is all about moving quickly to get the team (or a package) out and away.

I'm not convinced he was a very good SR4 build, but he was my first character so I stuck with the concept. Knowing this, porting him across I tried to match everything (including similar discussions about cyber etc) and in the end kept the concept of the character and re-built him against that concept in the Window.

If I can dig out my notes on him in SR4 and the Window I'll type them up later so you can see.
Still getting used to the site; please bear with. :)
User avatar
Delia2531
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:00 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby PMiller » Thu May 12, 2016 1:01 am

Hat wrote:Btw, Paro: feasible or too impractical in terms of the shifting appearance?
Hmmm, not sure on that one. Certainly, it is tough on avatars. :wink: Maybe he has a handful of persona instead of always a different one? Tough to build a rep if you like someone else all the time. Dunno. Let me think on that one.

I am also a bit out of touch with the Conversion Document (and I wrote it :mrgreen: ). We never really play-tested the magic part of it much yet, but like always we will be flexible on it and figure out the kinks. Of the conversions, SR was the trickiest, but in the end it was less time consuming than SR4.
:smt024
Playing & DMing: Anytime, anywhere.
DM Workshop Notes
User avatar
PMiller
Gaming Commander
Gaming Commander
 
Posts: 12313
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:33 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Delia2531 » Thu May 12, 2016 1:26 am

Female Sr4 Fran(z)

Male Sr4 Franz (slight rebuild):

Window Franz

From my notes it looks like the build for Franz was:

Traits 44 (1 carried as development XP)
Skills (80)
Added to traits 5
Active skills 33 (5 carried as development XP)
Knowledge skills 17
Qualities -4
Contacts 23
Gear/cash 6

I like to think I've kept the feel of a rugged guy who can rush in and either patch you up or drag you out; who can come along with the team as an extra pair of hands/gun and has enough protection to keep him and his patient alive on the way out.
Still getting used to the site; please bear with. :)
User avatar
Delia2531
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:00 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Hat » Thu May 12, 2016 4:05 am

PM,

Let me preface this by stating that my understanding of The Window as a system is very limited, so I apologize if what I'm proposing is unbalanced.

As I think about the way SR handles Magic and the Astral and how that might map back to The Window, it draws on corrolaries between the Astral and the Physical.

I would suggest a mapping of Traits from the mental to the physical for astral combat.

Perception --> Strength
Wisdom --> Agility
Wisdom --> Health

I'm not thrilled necessarily with Wisdom applying to both stats, but I didn't necessarily feel good about luck being a mapping to a physical stat.

Assensing is perception looking at a different spectrum, similar in some ways to being able to see thermo or radar. The Perception skill has already been replaced with the Trait and my suggestion would be to eliminate Assensing as a skill. Access to it is a Quality (through Astral Perception as an Adept Ability, perhaps direct or part of Magician) and then the character rolls their perception check normally depending on how they are focused on sensing.

Astral combat takes place using magic, hand to hand, archery or melee. The key difference is that Mana spells become physical spells and weapons need to be weapon foci or they don't work there. As such I'd probably eliminate the astral combat skill and just keep the mapping simple. If you want to use a weapon focus, have the appropriate skill as the character would be using that for physical combat anyway. It keeps things clean and there wouldn't be a disconnect between a d8 physical swordsman suddenly forgetting how to use his weapon focus sword in the Astral with a d20 Astral combat skill.

For the magician trait I would suggest equating it to both the magic attribute and force. So for the d12 trait the character effectively has a Magic of 3 and a Force cap of 3 before overcasting. The table would look like

D30 - Magic/Force 1
D20 - Magic/Force 2
D12 - Magic/Force 3
D10 - Magic/Force 4
D8 - Magic/Force 5
D6 - Magic/Force 6
D4 - Magic/Force 7 (Requires Initiation)

Sorcery, Conjuration, Arcana and Enchanting still describe how skilled the character is, the Magician trait simply describes how much Oomph could be put behind it. So with a Sorcery skill of d8, a Magician trait of d12 and the Manabolt spell, d8 is used to determine if the character hits, d12 is used for damage.

If you wanted to further limit the Conjuration skill, you could limit the Force of the spirit summoned safely (before overcast) to the Force level corresponding to Conjuration. So a d8 Magician (Force 5) with a d20 Conjuration, could safely summon Force 2 spirits, but they aren't skilled enough to summon more powerful spirits without risk.

The table above then also serves as a translation for any magical gear acquired and the maximum effect (for sustain) or damage (for weapon) for example.

Thoughts?

With a sweep of his...

Hat
Hat
Villager
Villager
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 8:32 am

Re: First Run [OOC]

Postby Hat » Thu May 12, 2016 2:59 pm

Ok, I've made a first pass draft at my Face. Tentatively naming him Xanadu. Not sold on having the right balance of elements yet. It's gone through a lot of tweaking so far. I'm also curious what effect the different qualities other than Magician will have on the character. Other than bi-lingual, they're not factored in. 5 XP on money feels really light, but I'm not sure where to take the other XP from. I'd started at double that, but felt like the character needed rounding out, and I could make do with less cash at least initially if needed.

As a general description, the character is an Asian elf speaking accented English. He's recently arrived on the scene in Seattle and is getting settled in. Xanadu is a man with a photographic memory and no clear memories of anything before turning up in Seattle within the last year (Amnesia, possibly more recently than a year depending on what works best). His first clear memory is of someone he believes is his twin sister being thankful that he's awake, going for help and never returning. She's definitely in flashbacks, but they're not memories he's able to hold onto as frustrating as that is. He makes friends easily, befriending both personalities of Sybil early in his stay. He has an ear for languages, knows how to fit in in most circumstances and is an awakened mage. Attempting to find himself by searching the Matrix, failed. He quickly discovered that even a new digital footprint faded within a week, leaving behind only what he believed to be an assumed identity or at least one of the ones he had on him.

Physically he's extremely good looking, perhaps in his mid twenties, but being an elf, it's hard to say what his exact age is. Ethnically he looks mixed race with some clear Mongolian features. The credsticks he had on him helped get him established. Uncertain where to go back to or where his sister may have gone, he's slipped into the shadows of Seattle, looking for work, and answers.

spoiler: show
Code: Select all
Traits
Strength       d12 (5)
Agility      d12 (5)
Health      d12 (5)
Perception    d10 (9)
Wisdom      d8 (14)
Luck       d12 (5)
                43 (1 XP for skills)

Qualities [7] [31 positive, 24 negative]
Magician              d10 (10)
Photographic Memory   d12 (6)
First Impression     d20 (3)
Erased         d20 (3)
Bi-lingual              d20 (3)
Linguist              d20 (3)
Infravision              d20 (3)
Combat Paralysis   d8 (-15)
Amnesia         d12(-6)
Flashbacks              d20 (-3)
Lost Loved Ones    (Missing Twin, no points)

Skills [80 & 12 d20, +14 & 4 d20]
Resources     [5]   ($62,500)
Active Skills   [33]   (8 d20)
Conjuring              d20 (0)
Sorcery         d10 (7)
Influence              d8  (12)
Intimidate              d12 (3)
Firearms              d10 (7)
Ground vehicles      d12 (3)
Athletics              d20 (0)
Stealth         d20 (0)
Melee         d30 (1)

Knowledge     [7]   (3 d20)
K: Etiquette      d10 (7)
K: Seattle Shadow
   Movers & Shakers   d20 (0)   
K: Club Scene      d20 (0)

Languages           [9]   (0 d20)
Khalaka         Native - Primary language of Mongolia
Sperethriel      Native
English         d12 (6)
Mandarin              d30 (1)
Cantonese              d30 (1)
Japanese              d30 (1)


Spells      [22]   (5 d20)
Combat
   Death Touch      d12 (3)
Detection
   Detect Individual   d20 (3)
   Mindlink              d10 (7)
Illusion
   Invisibility      d12 (3)
   Mask         d12 (3)
Manipulation
   Influence      d20 (3)
   Mana Barrier      d20 (0)

Contacts   [12]           (0 d20)
Johnson         d20 (3)
Fixer                 d20 (3)
Club Owner      d20 (3)
Arms Dealer      d30 (1)
Mechanic              d30 (1)
Street Doc              d30 (1)
Hat
Villager
Villager
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 8:32 am

Next

Return to First Run [Shadowrun/The Window]

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest